Hours and Advice

[Supernube]

Hello all. I am new to the forum and I am looking for advice please.
I am a hand cutter currently cutting for various Forestry contractors in the South West and I am looking to move from a hand cutting to running an excavator based Harvester.
Not entirely sure what machine it will be but the one I just based my finance on was a Hyundai 145 LCR.... it will be similar for sure.
My question is regarding hours...how many hours are too many ?
I have read that general overall condition is a good sign that the machine would have been looked after...but not sure how many hours should be avoided...or what are average..high..low?
The machine I was looking at had around 3800 hours on it...which I believe is pretty good ?

Also...what should I look for when looking over the machine...I am a COMPLETE novice with regards to excavators and have no idea what to look for....slew ring movement tolerances ? etc etc... Im not going to bother mentioning things ive only read about ..I simply need advice please.
I will obviously try and take somebody with me...If I can actually find some I KNOW..that also knows about diggers....which off the top of my head....is nobody.

Any advice will be very much appreciated.

Thank you
Daniel

[v8druid]

Hello all. I am new to the forum and I am looking for advice please.
I am a hand cutter currently cutting for various Forestry contractors in the South West and I am looking to move from a hand cutting to running an excavator based Harvester.
Not entirely sure what machine it will be but the one I just based my finance on was a Hyundai 145 LCR.... it will be similar for sure.
My question is regarding hours...how many hours are too many ?
I have read that general overall condition is a good sign that the machine would have been looked after...but not sure how many hours should be avoided...or what are average..high..low?
The machine I was looking at had around 3800 hours on it...which I believe is pretty good ?

Also...what should I look for when looking over the machine...I am a COMPLETE novice with regards to excavators and have no idea what to look for....slew ring movement tolerances ? etc etc... Im not going to bother mentioning things ive only read about ..I simply need advice please.
I will obviously try and take somebody with me...If I can actually find some I KNOW..that also knows about diggers....which off the top of my head....is nobody.

Any advice will be very much appreciated.

Thank you
Daniel

welcome Daniel .... what part of the world are you ??

Interesting choice on the m/c front ..... how long is a piece of string basically, when it comes to choice

How old is said digger ?? 3800 is a lot on a 2 yr old m/c ..... not so much on a 5 yr old m/c .... what's its provenance ? Owner op or hire fleet ..... could do a lot of damage in 38 hrs in a fleet

some folk love Hyundai ... or some particular models at least .... other's wouldn't cross the road to look at one.
tree felling with an excavator is, IMHDO, an experienced op.s game .... can go wrong real quick
also needs to be kitted out to suit its application ...... safety screens, etc., etc..
I can think of a few that'd be a good start point for how/what/etc. ..... but they'd send you to sleep or do your swede ... eh Muz and I don't mean Muz

[Supernube]

Hello mate. Thank you for the reply..I appreciate it.
Im in Devon... The digger was 6 years old...not sure about owner or fleet but didnt get that far with the questions as I knew I was going to miss that particular one.
As I said ..I wouldnt know a good model of digger from a bad one....Hyundai or whatever else...Doosan ...I dont think the machine type is set...I just mentioned that one because that was the one on sale. I think overall strength and build of the machine will be very important in the woods...bit rougher than your average building site.
Im not worried about the learning curve with the machine ..I know trees...been in the woods since I left school..but obviously I understand the learning curve involved with the move to machines....and all the forestry guarding is done as part of the sale...I can even do that myself if necessary.
Any machine recommendations ..or machines to avoid ..or any other advice will be very much appreciated.
Thanks again for the reply
Daniel

[v8druid]

Hello mate. Thank you for the reply..I appreciate it.
Im in Devon... The digger was 6 years old...not sure about owner or fleet but didnt get that far with the questions as I knew I was going to miss that particular one.
As I said ..I wouldnt know a good model of digger from a bad one....Hyundai or whatever else...Doosan ...I dont think the machine type is set...I just mentioned that one because that was the one on sale. I think overall strength and build of the machine will be very important in the woods...bit rougher than your average building site.
Im not worried about the learning curve with the machine ..I know trees...been in the woods since I left school..but obviously I understand the learning curve involved with the move to machines....and all the forestry guarding is done as part of the sale...I can even do that myself if necessary.
Any machine recommendations ..or machines to avoid ..or any other advice will be very much appreciated.
Thanks again for the reply
Daniel

now that's the way to endear one's self here ..... (no ref to you Boyo, but another newbie post, who really knows how to rub folk up the wrong way from post 1 )

Biggest and most important Q to get out the way is BUDGET!!?

No good recommending this, that, or the other, if they're too much strain on the piggy bank

Then you also need to determine a 'modus operandi' ?
Tree shear, grapple saw, harvesting head, etc.?
What size timber are we talking about?

Older and solid, or new hi-faluting whizz bang ?

the newer you go the more tech there is to go west, leaving you in the woods with a dead machine, for something bloody silly, that needs a lap top to fix it .... attached to an expensive fitter's arm

Older and solid though does not come without its inherent issues

There are some definite no no,s, or 'best avoided' choices too. Plus folks do tend to have their 'favorites' ... usually from good experiences though, so these can be a relatively reasonable 'steer'

Some manufacturers are also better as they progress (and improve) ... others just seem to lose the plot and produce some dogs
then there is also consensus of opinions ...... if 95% of folk like a machine / manufacturer .... it/they must be doing something right
conversely .... if it's a universal slating ..... it may well fall into the 'best avoided' category - without further procrastination

there's also 'market' to consider .... home only, or are you willing to look further afield and import something, if it's just what you want?
Stuff on the home market doesn't tend to get the same attention lavished on it, as in many other countries. so an older (and less techy) import could be in far better condition than a much newer UK machine

you might like to have a shufty here, for example ......
https://www.finn.no/b2b/construction...nt=8003&sort=0
.......for ideas

At least you're doing some research, which will hopefully help you, in the long run ... so let's get down to brass tacks and throw a few criteria at us

[Supernube]

I have a bit of money behind me...but not the full amount....Im looking at something around £90,000....thats finished and ready for the woods....head...guarding.. the lot.
Timber will be anything from thinnings to final felling ..nothing huge...still fell bigger stuff by hand and winch it....looking to fit in the gap where the bigger machines wont go...do a tidier job and leave less of a foot print.

I'll have a winch on the boom ...so also be able to fill possible gaps in work winching for other people and dealing with it in the process.

Head will be something like a Keto100 ..AFM35/45 ..I was offered a fully reconditioned Keto100 on the machine they would build for me....but not sure on the Keto heads yet...

Also be able to swap over to a bucket should It be needed...or a mulcher maybe ...dont know...just nice to be able to do more than just the one thing...another advantage as far as keeping busy.

Older or newer...I dont know ? I just want solid and reliable ..so I have to break it not it break itself ...it would be nice to get some work done and gain at least some experience before I have to start breaking the machine for repairs...Not looking forward to that one lol.

I see CAT and Hitachi praised a lot..? well certain models anyway...no one seems to even mention Doosan or Hyundai ...apart from saying that the panels on them are thin ? ...Im looking for a 14 tonne machine...zero tail swing...Ive even seen a couple of 8 tonne machines doing a pretty good job in thinnings...but think I'll stay on the 14 tonne machines so I dont lose out on reasonable sized stuff.

Importing is something else I know nothing about...and Im very impatient ...think I'd stay here and get someone to look over the machine for me...but depends.

Like I said ...machines are very new to me...so I accept I dont know enough to really say too much ...but I think I know what I want...and what I want it for...
but...maybe I dont lol.

Thanks again

[Supernube]

and that site is great...some nice looking machines on there...well they seem clean anyway...better if I could actually understand what Im trying to read though ...is there no "English" button ?

[Muz]

I think for your application, extra heavy undercarriage in GOOD condition is a must also.. avoid long crawler frames where possible unless you do a lot of wet ground work .. most machines are well enough built these days to still be in their prime at 3000 hours ... AS LONG as its not done all of that on hammer work ! .. good dealer support and reasonable prices for spares are as an important consideration as anything now, but the brand you mention seems well enough regarded. I think also at those hours, you knocked off a good chunk of depreciation, so the price will be lower, but at those hours, it will still have good life in it. So its quite a hard balancing act, after all, you'll want something that still holds some value too, so its still worth something when you are done with it .... and keep all the bits from the original so you can convert it back, which will make it more saleable when your ready to move it on Good luck and welcome also

[v8druid]

and that site is great...some nice looking machines on there...well they seem clean anyway...better if I could actually understand what Im trying to read though ...is there no "English" button ?

right click on a blank bit of page and select translate to english from the drop down that appears ..... you eventually get to learn some Norwegian

Great site and changes hourly ..... anything 'up in the year' will be in good order ...... they got a sort of plant MOT out there and even the old stuff has to have it too if on hire
It's a very different world, to the UK market and getting stuff back is not as dear as you'd think .... DFDS do a roll on roll off rate for plant ... track it on / off ... no need for a truck under it .... save huge amounts.
nearly ended up buying a duck from there and a 15t duck, back to UK was circa 600 quid ... bout a fifth of cost of getting summat home from europe

[v8druid]

last march one of these was £68K with 3 geith buckets and hitch ..... hell of a tool ... it is however close to 18t fighting weight

Spent 7 weeks watching a mate operating this, from a dumper cab and had several hours seat time myself .... it was a lovely tool
Also know another guy who has just bought an identical machine and loves his too

the blade is sooooooo handy and it pushes like no tomorrow

[Supernube]

right click on a blank bit of page and select translate to english from the drop down that appears ..... you eventually get to learn some Norwegian

Great site and changes hourly ..... anything 'up in the year' will be in good order ...... they got a sort of plant MOT out there and even the old stuff has to have it too if on hire
It's a very different world, to the UK market and getting stuff back is not as dear as you'd think .... DFDS do a roll on roll off rate for plant ... track it on / off ... no need for a truck under it .... save huge amounts.
nearly ended up buying a duck from there and a 15t duck, back to UK was circa 600 quid ... bout a fifth of cost of getting summat home from europe

All this information is excellent ...thank you very much for taking the time.
I did actually figure out the translation problem...I used google translate.
The whole MOT type set up sounds a good idea too...what sort of things would come under the "mot" ...? Pins...play...swing bearing ? pumps ?
And if its that cheap to get it back here I see no reason to buy a machine in this country ...the whole "MOT" thing is a major reason to buy from there...no ?
I will ask you more questions about where I start when it comes to sorting out getting it back here...or will the company you mentioned explain all that If I contact them ?
Think I'll see about getting finance on the machine purchase ...and sort out getting it ready for the woods with out of my own pocket.
The machine you pictured below is the exact machine I wanted....So its good to know that you rate them highly....
You have a put a smile on my face tonight mate and I thank you for that....Im very impressed with the site ...and very much appreciate all the help and advice you've given me.
Just as a warning ..there will no doubt be many more questions...mostly stupid ones I expect...but Im learning ;-)

[Supernube]

First stupid question ....lol...I take it that "up in the year" means newer stuff ?
and ..what sort of money do you think I could get away with spending..and still get a good solid machine...?

[v8druid]

All this information is excellent ...thank you very much for taking the time.
I did actually figure out the translation problem...I used google translate.
The whole MOT type set up sounds a good idea too...what sort of things would come under the "mot" ...? Pins...play...swing bearing ? pumps ?
And if its that cheap to get it back here I see no reason to buy a machine in this country ...the whole "MOT" thing is a major reason to buy from there...no ?
I will ask you more questions about where I start when it comes to sorting out getting it back here...or will the company you mentioned explain all that If I contact them ?
Think I'll see about getting finance on the machine purchase ...and sort out getting it ready for the woods with out of my own pocket.
The machine you pictured below is the exact machine I wanted....So its good to know that you rate them highly....
You have a put a smile on my face tonight mate and I thank you for that....Im very impressed with the site ...and very much appreciate all the help and advice you've given me.
Just as a warning ..there will no doubt be many more questions...mostly stupid ones I expect...but Im learning ;-)

LOL
we all started clueless at some point Daniel .... I've posed some corkers in my time too .... dare say we all have.

finance and importing aren't very good bed fellows ... here in the UK. I know from a friend's recent experiences ... finance houses do not like it at all.... back in blighty and it'd be a different issue, so you may have to be able to fund a purchase outright to get summat home ..... then finance it 'praps. .... 'swhat he did.

As for Doosan's beasty .... if I was going to buy a new m/c of that sort of ilk ... I'd have no qualms at all, based on my experiences last year, both observing it, in the hands of a seriously good operator and from my own limited experiences of it, from the pilot's seat. Hell of a tool,especially for the bucks. Good on fuel, rarely needed anything but eco , unless ripping rock and wound up, didn't it ever dig. Real steady on it's feet and pushed like a dozer. Smooth as silk on the sticks .... an all round brahmer IMHDO

As said, I also know someone else who's just bought a new one and blown his wad on a tilty for it too ..... he adores his.

They are, from my engineering perspective, a very nicely put together tool, with good detail attention .

as for the Norwegian MOT, I don't honestly know, but could find out .... have a contact in Norway with his own duck and a time served plant fitter ... he looked a few over out there for me, when I was 'duck hunting', before the 'Drema came up

I dealt with Jill Hirst at DFDS ( "Hirst Jill (ukimm-sales)" jill.hirst@dfds.com ) .....explained I was considering purchasing a m/c out there nad needed an idea of a cost to get it home; gave her the shipping dimensions/weights of a couple of different m/cs and had a PDF quote back within an hour or two, each time, for the different machines.

driving them on/off the boat is pretty routine, it would seem ... allows them more freight, if there's no truck under them and can tuck them into corners .... which you'd struggle to do with a 44t lowloader

Any deal you might do out there'd be best done for a delivered to port price (transport out there is not cheap and easier to let the seller sort) .... Brevik is where DFDS sail from to Immingham.
IIRC you get two or three days free storage at port, each end, to allow for getting tranny into Brevik on time and for collection arrangements this end, in case they're late arriving (bad weather, etc.).
Not a lot is cheap in Norway ......... 'cept s/hand diggers it would seem .. just over 11 NOK to the pound ATM ... was over 12 when I was 'shopping' .... usually between 10 and 12 NOK (Krona)

As for the input boyo ..... I had a lot of seriously good help from a couple of good guys on forums when i was hunting my duck .. I'm just trying to reciprocate, but be aware i am not a plant background ... least not earthmoving plant, but have learnt a huge amount about them in the last few years

got a few threads, if you want to check me out a bit

http://www.plantandconstruction.co.u...Druid-central-!!

http://www.plantandconstruction.co.u...uids-Duck-Hunt

http://www.plantandconstruction.co.u...-DruidFab-VA-r

http://www.plantandconstruction.co.u...b-Attachments-!!

http://www.plantandconstruction.co.u...various-nature!!

First stupid question ....lol...I take it that "up in the year" means newer stuff ?
and ..what sort of money do you think I could get away with spending..and still get a good solid machine...?

"I take it that "up in the year" means newer stuff " spot on mate

"what sort of money do you think I could get away with spending " ...... how long is a piece of string .... set a max budget that you can go to and if it comes in cheaper ... win, win .... I had to up my budget on me duck hunt .... a few times .... but ended up with a great tool.

[Muz]

I think I smell some beer and a shopping trip I know it took you many months to find your own machine V8

[v8druid]

I think I smell some beer and a shopping trip I know it took you many months to find your own machine V8

that it did Muz .... a bloody long time, even after 'upping the ante' a few times .... she's a peach though

[Vinpetrol]

A friend of mine does forestry work and has used various bog standard 13 toners for a long time .
his work is generally mounding though so he doesn’t need to spec them to highly.
he recently bought a new Hyundai 140 with a bigger under carriage the size you’d get on a 20 toner . It’s excellent for the conditions and was factory built by Hyundai . As it’s new I’m sure it’s well equipped electrically to take anything you’d want to fit on it .
I like the Hyundai’s as they are tough as old boots and you will need that in the woods .
this is only my opinion but I wouldn’t go for a jcb .

Vin